A First Resurrection Has Already Occurred


A First Resurrection

Abinadi said the following:

And behold, I say unto you, this is not all.

For O how beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that is the founder of peace, yea, even the Lord, who has redeemed his people; yea, him who has granted salvation unto his people; for were it not for the redemption which he hath made for his people, which was prepared from the foundation of the world, I say unto you, were it not for this, all mankind must have perished.  But behold, the bands of death shall be broken, and the Son reigneth, and hath power over the dead; therefore, he bringeth to pass the resurrection of the dead.  And there cometh a resurrection, even a first resurrection; yea, even a resurrection of those that have been, and who are, and who shall be, even until the resurrection of Christ—for so shall he be called.

And now, the resurrection of all the prophets, and all those that have believed in their words, or all those that have kept the commandments of God, shall come forth in the first resurrection; therefore, they are the first resurrection.  They are raised to dwell with God who has redeemed them; thus they have eternal life through Christ, who has broken the bands of death.  And these are those who have part in the first resurrection; and these are they that have died before Christ came, in their ignorance, not having salvation declared unto them. And thus the Lord bringeth about the restoration of these; and they have a part in the first resurrection, or have eternal life, being redeemed by the Lord.  And little children also have eternal life.

But behold, and fear, and tremble before God, for ye ought to tremble; for the Lord redeemeth none such that rebel against him and die in their sins; yea, even all those that have perished in their sins ever since the world began, that have wilfully rebelled against God, that have known the commandments of God, and would not keep them; these are they that have no part in the first resurrection.  (Mosiah 15:19-26)

Alma said the following, paraphrasing and expanding upon the teaching of Abinadi:

Now, there are some that have understood that this state of happiness and this state of misery of the soul, before the resurrection, was a first resurrection. Yea, I admit it may be termed a resurrection, the raising of the spirit or the soul and their consignation to happiness or misery, according to the words which have been spoken.

And behold, again it hath been spoken, that there is a first resurrection, a resurrection of all those who have been, or who are, or who shall be, down to the resurrection of Christ from the dead.

Now, we do not suppose that this first resurrection, which is spoken of in this manner, can be the resurrection of the souls and their consignation to happiness or misery. Ye cannot suppose that this is what it meaneth.

Behold, I say unto you, Nay; but it meaneth the reuniting of the soul with the body, of those from the days of Adam down to the resurrection of Christ.

Now, whether the souls and the bodies of those of whom has been spoken shall all be reunited at once, the wicked as well as the righteous, I do not say; let it suffice, that I say that they all come forth; or in other words, their resurrection cometh to pass before the resurrection of those who die after the resurrection of Christ.

Now, my son, I do not say that their resurrection cometh at the resurrection of Christ; but behold, I give it as my opinion, that the souls and the bodies are reunited, of the righteous, at the resurrection of Christ, and his ascension into heaven.

But whether it be at his resurrection or after, I do not say; but this much I say, that there is a space between death and the resurrection of the body, and a state of the soul in happiness or in misery until the time which is appointed of God that the dead shall come forth, and be reunited, both soul and body, and be brought to stand before God, and be judged according to their works. (Alma 40:15-21)

Notice, in particular, these words of Alma:

Now, whether the souls and the bodies of those of whom has been spoken shall all be reunited at once, the wicked as well as the righteous, I do not say; let it suffice, that I say that they all come forth; or in other words, their resurrection cometh to pass before the resurrection of those who die after the resurrection of Christ.  (Alma 40:19)

So, all those who died before the resurrection of Christ, both the righteous and the wicked, get resurrected before all those who die after the resurrection of Christ. The resurrection of those who die before Jesus’s resurrection, then, is termed a first resurrection.  (And within this first resurrection, the resurrection of the just is called the first resurrection.)  The resurrection of those who die after Jesus’s resurrection, then, might be termed a second resurrection.  (And within this second resurrection, the resurrection of the just is still called the first resurrection.)

21 September 1823

Moroni appeared to Joseph Smith, Jun., on 21 September 1823, as a resurrected personage.  As Moroni died after the resurrection of Christ and was now resurrected, this means that every single person who died before the resurrection of Christ, both the righteous as well as the wicked, had already been resurrected.  So, all those dead souls that lived during that approximately 4000 years were alive by that date.

After resurrection comes judgment

Alma taught that there is a “time which is appointed of God that the dead shall come forth, and be reunited, both soul and body, and be brought to stand before God, and be judged according to their works.”  After you get resurrected, then, you get brought to stand before God and you get judged.  As far as I can recall, there is no indication in any scripture that there is a space of time or waiting period between the resurrection and your judgment.

So far we know from this that between the resurrection of Christ and 21 September 1823, all the people who lived and died in the first 4000 or so years must have come forth and, if the logic follows, must have been subsequently judged by God.  But they didn’t necessarily come forth at the same moment during this span of 1,823 years.  Alma also said:

Now my son, here is somewhat more I would say unto thee; for I perceive that thy mind is worried concerning the resurrection of the dead.  Behold, I say unto you, that there is no resurrection—or, I would say, in other words, that this mortal does not put on immortality, this corruption does not put on incorruption—until after the coming of Christ.  Behold, he bringeth to pass the resurrection of the dead. But behold, my son, the resurrection is not yet.

Now, I unfold unto you a mystery; nevertheless, there are many mysteries which are kept, that no one knoweth them save God himself. But I show unto you one thing which I have inquired diligently of God that I might know—that is concerning the resurrection.  Behold, there is a time appointed that all shall come forth from the dead. Now when this time cometh no one knows; but God knoweth the time which is appointed.  Now, whether there shall be one time, or a second time, or a third time, that men shall come forth from the dead, it mattereth not; for God knoweth all these things; and it sufficeth me to know that this is the case—that there is a time appointed that all shall rise from the dead.

Now whether there is more than one time appointed for men to rise it mattereth not; for all do not die at once, and this mattereth not; all is as one day with God, and time only is measured unto men. (Alma 40:1-5,8)

The First Resurrection

We obviously know that the righteous (Celestial and Terrestrial souls) came forth first, inheriting the first resurrection, whereas the Telestial souls and the sons of perdition were resurrected afterward.  So, the scriptures that speak of the many saints rising at the resurrection of Christ in the land of Jerusalem and also among the Nephites were those of the first resurrection.  This may have been only a part of those of the first resurrection, for some righteous souls needed to remain in Paradise to perform the missionary labors in the spirit world until more saints died after the resurrection of Christ, who could then take over these labors for them, allowing those who died before the resurrection of Christ to now leave Paradise without the missionary work suffering.  As to the resurrection of all the rest among this group, we have no information about when this occurred, except that it was finished by 21 September 1823.

Judged by the books

Here’s where it gets particularly interesting, for we learn from Joseph Smith that the dead must be judged out of the records which have been kept concerning the dead, and in particular the records of the ordinances which they have received, whether these were done while they were yet alive or done vicariously by someone else:

And further, I want you to remember that John the Revelator was contemplating this very subject in relation to the dead, when he declared, as you will find recorded in Revelation 20:12—

And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

You will discover in this quotation that the books were opened; and another book was opened, which was the book of life; but the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works; consequently, the books spoken of must be the books which contained the record of their works, and refer to the records which are kept on the earth. And the book which was the book of life is the record which is kept in heaven; the principle agreeing precisely with the doctrine which is commanded you in the revelation contained in the letter which I wrote to you previous to my leaving my place—that in all your recordings it may be recorded in heaven.

Now, the nature of this ordinance consists in the power of the priesthood, by the revelation of Jesus Christ, wherein it is granted that whatsoever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatsoever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Or, in other words, taking a different view of the translation, whatsoever you record on earth shall be recorded in heaven, and whatsoever you do not record on earth shall not be recorded in heaven; for out of the books shall your dead be judged, according to their own works, whether they themselves have attended to the ordinances in their own propria persona, or by the means of their own agents, according to the ordinance which God has prepared for their salvation from before the foundation of the world, according to the records which they have kept concerning their dead.

It may seem to some to be a very bold doctrine that we talk of—a power which records or binds on earth and binds in heaven. Nevertheless, in all ages of the world, whenever the Lord has given a dispensation of the priesthood to any man by actual revelation, or any set of men, this power has always been given. Hence, whatsoever those men did in authority, in the name of the Lord, and did it truly and faithfully, and kept a proper and faithful record of the same, it became a law on earth and in heaven, and could not be annulled, according to the decrees of the great Jehovah. This is a faithful saying. Who can hear it?  (D&C 128:6-9)

Now surely many of the righteous saints of this 4000 year period had their ordinances done while alive, and these records were kept somewhere, and thus there was no lag time needed for their resurrection and judgment, for the records already existed, but what of the others of the same period, who had not had their ordinance work done, yet?  If they got resurrected, there could be no subsequent judgment, for judgment must be “out of the books.”  If, then, judgment does, indeed, immediately follow resurrection, then none of these could be resurrected until the ordinance work was done for them, for none of them could be judged.

We know that the Jewish church performed baptisms for the dead in the land of Jerusalem after Christ was resurrected, and we can assume the same with all the other sheep of the fold, but the Jewish church didn’t last long.  Could they do all the ordinances that needed to be done during that time?  Maybe the lost tribes church had more time.  We don’t have this information.

What we do know, though, is that the Nephites had a sort of Millennium experience after Christ visited them, and they got the whole thing, the entire revelation of the brother of Jared, which revealed all things.  It is possible, then, that it was the Nephites, those ultra diligent, miracle-working people of the Lord, that performed these labors, doing all the ordinance work and writing all the records, recording and doing everything and completing the work for all those of the first 4000 years.  As they had all the information, and they lasted for quite some time, and they were super diligent, more so than any other branch of Israel, they might have finished this enormous task in record time.  But we don’t yet know if this was the case.

Setting in order the house of God

This leads to an even more bizarre scenario.  If the resurrection of the dead must wait for the ordinance work to be done, and we have a resurrection coming up, even the first resurrection, which will happen at the Second Coming of Christ, and this resurrection will be for all those Celestial and Terrestrial souls who died after the resurrection of Christ, which is a period of about 2000 years, then that would mean that all these ordinances for the dead must be done before Christ comes back, not during the Millennium.

Our common LDS belief is that the work for the dead will be an ongoing task of the Millennium.  This is not a scriptural understanding, but was put forth by Brigham Young, I believe.  Doctrine and Covenants section 85, though, is curious, because it says, “I, the Lord God, will send one mighty and strong…to set in order the house of God,” which I have interpreted to mean putting the temple and other church records in perfect order.  As this will be done by the miraculous power of God working in this servant, the apparent impossibility of doing all the vicarious work for the dead and making the records complete before the Second Coming of Christ is not an issue.  In other words, just because there ain’t enough time or even enough people to get all the work done and all the records filled out and perfected before Christ comes doesn’t matter.  This servant will be able to do it, anyway.  If, in fact, these ordinances and records need to be done before the first resurrection (which takes place at the Second Coming)—otherwise all these people can’t be resurrected—then it makes sense that God must send someone endowed with seemingly unlimited power to accomplish the feat.

I am not saying that this is the case.  I am just saying that if this is the case, then we’ve got things wrong concerning the Millennium and the vicarious work for the dead and the resurrection and judgment.  And I am also saying that if this turns out to be true, then this servant is going to have the biggest work load (impossibly big) of anyone who ever lived and he will have to accomplish it all in an impossibly small amount of time, which is getting smaller all the time (since he apparently hasn’t even started working, yet.)

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20 Comments

  1. If all the wicked who had died before Christ’s resurrection were resurrected by 1823, what are all those skulls and bones dating to the pre-A.D. times which fill the museums? Why were those bones not resurrected?

  2. Good question. Either Alma is wrong, this post’s interpretation of Alma’s words is wrong, or our dating is wrong and the artifacts are from more recent times. Or, our understanding of Moroni is wrong. In other words, Moroni was not resurrected, but was translated. If that is the case, then the pre-Christ dead may still be dead, since no post-Christ person has been resurrected.

    FWIW, I do not believe that this post’s interpretation of Alma’s words is wrong…

  3. If it turns out that Moroni was translated, and not resurrected, then that would open up yet another possibility: that the pre-Christ dead still need their work done. And if the work must be done before resurrection, then that would mean the workload would be even greater than put forth in this post. Instead of needing to finish the work for those of the last 2000 years, the one mighty and strong would need to finish the work of those of the last 6000 years. Either scenario is mind-boggling. It all depends on the answer to the question: Was Moroni resurrected or translated?

  4. John the Baptist had been decapitated and yet he laid his hands on Joseph in 1829 which shows that he was resurrected (unless, of course, it is possible to die and afterwards be translated).

  5. Ignore the last comment. John the Baptist doesnt count, he died before Christ’s resurrection.

  6. I will answer my own question.

    Was Moroni resurrected or translated?

    He was resurrected:

    And now I bid unto all, farewell. I soon go to rest in the paradise of God, until my spirit and body shall again reunite, and I am brought forth triumphant through the air, to meet you before the pleasing bar of the great Jehovah, the Eternal Judge of both quick and dead. Amen. (Moro. 19:34)

    So, Moroni died, and it is my understanding that he died at the hands of the Lamanites. So, this brings us back to the original scenario of the post.

    The whole thing is mysterious to me because, like I said, the resurrection and judgment seem to go hand in hand. Even Moroni’s words above seem to imply that once you are resurrected, you are immediately brought into judgment before God. It almost seems to me as though resurrection and judgment happen in eternity, not time, and thus are all accomplished in a single day, regardless of when you rise from the died. For example, there’s this scripture by Mormon:

    And he did expound all things, even from the beginning until the time that he should come in his glory—yea, even all things which should come upon the face of the earth, even until the elements should melt with fervent heat, and the earth should be wrapt together as a scroll, and the heavens and the earth should pass away; and even unto the great and last day, when all people, and all kindreds, and all nations and tongues shall stand before God, to be judged of their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil—if they be good, to the resurrection of everlasting life; and if they be evil, to the resurrection of damnation; being on a parallel, the one on the one hand and the other on the other hand, according to the mercy, and the justice, and the holiness which is in Christ, who was before the world began. (3 Ne. 26:3-5)

    The “great and last day” of judgment is a single day, in which all of us will be there. In other words, the different times of resurrection accomplished on earth appear to correspond to the time of day of that day of eternity. Those of the first resurrection come forth on the morning of that eternal day, the others later on in that day, but everyone is resurrected on that same eternal day, or once they are resurrected they instantly “enter eternity” and now find themselves in the presence of God:

    But God ceaseth not to be God, and mercy claimeth the penitent, and mercy cometh because of the atonement; and the atonement bringeth to pass the resurrection of the dead; and the resurrection of the dead bringeth back men into the presence of God; and thus they are restored into his presence, to be judged according to their works, according to the law and justice. (Alma 42:23)

    The whole thing appears to happen together, resurrection brings us into that eternal day, into the presence of God, to be judged. It sounds like the past-present-future thing of a previous post, all over again. In other words, time operates linearly, but eternity doesn’t, it operates simultaneously, so that a man who is resurrected 1000 years ago and one who is resurrected 1000 years from now would both come forth through the air, in eternity, as if it were the same day, to be judged that very day. The time aspects don’t matter, since time doesn’t constrain eternity.

    But none of this explains the bones, though, so there is a real mystery here.

  7. So, rereading Mosiah 15:21-26 takes on a new meaning in light of this post

    There is “A first resurrection” which encompasses everyone

    21 And there cometh a resurrection, even a first resurrection; yea, even a resurrection of those that have been, and who are, and who shall be, even until the resurrection of Christ—for so shall he be called.
    (Mosiah 15:21)

    Within this “A first resurrection” there is THE first resurrection which includes only the righteous/children etc.

    22 And now, the resurrection of all the prophets, and all those that have believed in their words, or all those that have kept the commandments of God, shall come forth in the first resurrection; therefore, they are the first resurrection.
    (Mosiah 15:22)

    But the wicked don’t have a part in “THE first resurrection”

    26 But behold, and fear, and tremble before God, for ye ought to tremble; for the Lord redeemeth none such that rebel against him and die in their sins; yea, even all those that have perished in their sins ever since the world began, that have wilfully rebelled against God, that have known the commandments of God, and would not keep them; these are they that have no part in the first resurrection.
    (Mosiah 15:26)

    But the text doesn’t say that the wicked don’t have a part in “A first resurrection”, only that they don’t have a part in “THE first resurrection”.
    While I lament the clumsiness of the wording here which may be the source of confusion for many, still, based on this passage there is a case to be made for “A first resurrection” of the wicked.

  8. Brigham Young may have been not too far off with the “Temple work during the Millenium” idea. Unless Im missing something, there is no urgency to make records for the tellestial souls before the Second Coming. Since their resurrection is slated for the end of the Millenium, the making of their records can wait until that time.

  9. To clarify my words written in a comment above: If a righteous man lived and died and was resurrected a thousand years ago, and another righteous man lived and died and was resurrected a thousand years from now, in the instant of their respective resurrections, they would both come forth, not in time anymore, but in the morning of the great and (eternal) last day. Upon seeing each other, if they asked one another, “When were you resurrected?” each one would respond, “Just now.” Time is linear, so there were 2,000 years between their resurrections, but in the instant they are resurrected, they enter eternity, which is not linear, but is arranged as God sees fit, the righteous coming forth in the morning and the wicked coming forth later on that same day, regardless of when everyone lived, died and was resurrected in time. Thus the first resurrection is all those that come forth in the morning of the eternal day of judgment, whether they lived in the first 4000 years, or the last 4000 years, of the Earth’s existence.

  10. jackdale76,

    Brigham Young may have been not too far off with the “Temple work during the Millenium” idea. Unless Im missing something, there is no urgency to make records for the tellestial souls before the Second Coming. Since their resurrection is slated for the end of the Millenium, the making of their records can wait until that time.

    Assuming that the unjust dead of the first 4000 years had their work done by the Nephites and the Jews and the Lost Tribes, allowing them all to be resurrected in “A” first resurrection, then only the unjust dead of the last 2000 years need their work done. The just dead of the last 2000 years must and will have their work done, otherwise they can’t be resurrected at Christ’s coming (following the logic of this post), which means that the Josephite must complete all of that work before Christ comes. If, though, he can accomplish so great a work, for the just dead, certainly he can do the very same thing for the unjust dead.

    His purpose is to “prepare the way of the Lord” by restoring all things. All things may include all the work for ALL the dead being done. It is this work already being done that may leave the unjust “without excuse.” In other words, they are not simply left sleeping in their graves, but they are called forth by the Lord:

    And again, another trump shall sound, which is the third trump; and then come the spirits of men who are to be judged, and are found under condemnation; and these are the rest of the dead; and they live not again until the thousand years are ended, neither again, until the end of the earth. (D&C 88:101)

    The reason why they are labeled unjust, or one of the reasons, is that the work has already been done for them, but they are not ready yet for resurrection, having still not repented. There is no reason to call forth spirits that cannot be resurrected because their work still hasn’t been done. But these spirits are all called forth, as if their work is completed already, and since they still haven’t repented, they are found under condemnation. So, it has the appearance of everything getting done before the Lord gets here. The Josephite preparing the ENTIRE way for the salvation of everyone.

  11. The existence of the Egyptian mummies, in particular, present a major problem to Alma’s words. It may be possible to account for this or that non-mummified skeleton, assigning it a more recent death, but the Egyptian mummies surely are not of recent date. (Also, other mummies have been discovered throughout the world.)

  12. Evidence ordinances must be done prior to the resurrection

    And verily I say unto you, that the conditions of this law are these: All covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, oaths, vows, performances, connections, associations, or expectations, that are not made and entered into and sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, of him who is anointed, both as well for time and for all eternity, and that too most holy, by revelation and commandment through the medium of mine anointed, whom I have appointed on the earth to hold this power (and I have appointed unto my servant Joseph to hold this power in the last days, and there is never but one on the earth at a time on whom this power and the keys of this priesthood are conferred), are of no efficacy, virtue, or force in and after the resurrection from the dead; for all contracts that are not made unto this end have an end when men are dead. (D&C 132:7)

    There is a finality to the resurrection. The resurrection appears to be the cut off event. Ordinances must be made (attended to in one’s own propia persona or through an agent, i.e., vicariously), entered into (accepted by the person) and sealed (accepted by the Lord) before the resurrection, otherwise it is invalid in and after the resurrection.

    And everything that is in the world, whether it be ordained of men, by thrones, or principalities, or powers, or things of name, whatsoever they may be, that are not by me or by my word, saith the Lord, shall be thrown down, and shall not remain after men are dead, neither in nor after the resurrection, saith the Lord your God. For whatsoever things remain are by me; and whatsoever things are not by me shall be shaken and destroyed. (D&C 132:13-14)

    The word “remain” implies an existence prior to the resurrection.

    Therefore, when they are out of the world they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are appointed angels in heaven, which angels are ministering servants, to minister for those who are worthy of a far more, and an exceeding, and an eternal weight of glory. (D&C 132:16)

    For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven. (Matt. 22:20)

    For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven. (Mark 12:25)

    And Jesus answering said unto them, The children of this world marry, and are given in marriage: but they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection. (Luke 20:34-36)

    Marriage sealings cannot occur after the resurrection. It is reasonable to assume that the same principle applies to all other gospel ordinances.

    Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? Why are they then baptized for the dead? (1 Cor. 15:29)

    And it came to pass that he said unto them: Behold, here are the waters of Mormon (for thus were they called) and now, as ye are desirous to come into the fold of God, and to be called his people, and are willing to bear one another’s burdens, that they may be light; yea, and are willing to mourn with those that mourn; yea, and comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to stand as witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—now I say unto you, if this be the desire of your hearts, what have you against being baptized in the name of the Lord, as a witness before him that ye have entered into a covenant with him, that ye will serve him and keep his commandments, that he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you? (Mosiah 18:6-10)

    All gospel ordinances are done with a view of the resurrection, i.e., they are “made unto this end,” resurrection being the end.

    I might have rendered a plainer translation to this, but it is sufficiently plain to suit my purpose as it stands. It is sufficient to know, in this case, that the earth will be smitten with a curse unless there is a welding link of some kind or other between the fathers and the children, upon some subject or other—and behold what is that subject? It is the baptism for the dead. For we without them cannot be made perfect; neither can they without us be made perfect. Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel also; for it is necessary in the ushering in of the dispensation of the fulness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in, that a whole and complete and perfect union, and welding together of dispensations, and keys, and powers, and glories should take place, and be revealed from the days of Adam even to the present time. And not only this, but those things which never have been revealed from the foundation of the world, but have been kept hid from the wise and prudent, shall be revealed unto babes and sucklings in this, the dispensation of the fulness of times. (D&C 128:18)

    A whole and complete and perfect union must take place before the dispensation of the fulness of times ushers in. In other words, everything has to be done in perfection, including ordinances, from Adam onward, and from heaven downward. Then Christ can come and the resurrection can happen.

    Conclusion

    Previously I said that Joseph Smith performed less than 1% of the restoration of all things, leaving 99% for Joseph-Nephi to finish, but with this post and its follow-up comments, it’s beginning to look like the Josephite will have to do 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999…% of the restoration of all things. In other words, what part of the restoration did Joseph Smith accomplish? Compared to what actually needs to be done, practically nothing. Not only will the Josephite need to complete the works of the present, but given Alma’s false prophecy of the pre-Christ dead rising before the post-Christ dead—which was falsified by the Lord when He resurrected Moroni—he will also need to “fix” the past, altering it so that this prophecy of Alma, and any other prophecy given by the power of the Holy Ghost, which did not come to pass as it was spoken, will have already happened. He will need to perform the work of all these dead souls, and then resurrect them before Moroni was resurrected, so that all the pre-Christ bones, skeletons and mummies in existence disappear, because these bodies are now all resurrected. Of course, no miracle worker would do such a miracle, unless it was necessary to do it, and given that God resurrected Moroni in contradiction to Alma’s words, He opened up the possibility or need to have such an unbelievably powerful miracle take place. So this man, the Josephite, must perform mighty works both in the present and also in the past. The operation of this miracle, of course, will be unknown to even have happened by the rest of humanity (for history will have been altered by his faith.) Only the Josephite and God will know what this man will have done. No prophecy given of the Holy Ghost must fail, otherwise God would cease to be God, therefore, He will have to review everything, and fix everything, so that all has come to pass as stated.

    The rational brain, of course, would say, in contradiction, “Alma’s prophecy failed, therefore he’s a false prophet, making the Book of Mormon false, making Joseph Smith a false prophet, making Mormonism false, making your own revelations and prophecies false.” And that’s surely a rational thought. But it appears that the appearance of the Lord is the cut off date and time for the prophecies to be fulfilled, so as there is still time (16 years and about 10 months left of this sixth thousand years), the appearance of the Josephite will be enough to fix everything. So, the enormous outpouring of faith on this guy is beginning to make a bit more sense, as to why so much power will be needed. Also, this shows that those who think they understand what the Josephite (or the One Mighty and Strong, as they like to refer to him, and sometimes as also the Servant) will do have a limited understanding (as in little to none.) He will be performing many more things than people realize. So, Alma’s false prophecy will eventually be made to be a true prophecy.

  13. Im curious to know if there are any pre-AD era bones of an infant (who was supposed to have been resurrected in THE first resurrection of A first resurrection)

  14. I’ve heard one population estimate stating that 70 billion people have lived on this planet. Another puts the number around 108 billion. Obviously, these are just guesstimates. But the point is that the numbers are huge. Now, how long does it take to count to one billion? Here’s an answer given by the editors at infoplease.com:

    It would depend on how fast you counted.

    Let’s suppose, for the sake of the argument, that you could count one number every second on average. (Since most numbers in that range are something like “five hundred million, seventeen thousand, two hundred and fifty,” this is being very optimistic.) In that case, it would take you a billion seconds.

    Dividing that by 60 (and leaving the remainder in second form), we find that it would take 16,666,666 minutes and 40 seconds. Dividing the minutes by 60, we find it would take 277,777 hours, 46 minutes, and 40 seconds. Dividing the hours by 24, we get a new total of 11,574 days, 1 hour, 46 minutes, and 40 seconds. Finally, dividing by 365.25 (the extra quarter-day is for leap years), we end up with an approximate total of 31 years, 251 days, 7 hours, 46 minutes, and 40 seconds.

    In short, if you want to count to a billion, you’d better start now.

    31 years just for 1 billion! For 100 billion you’d need 3100 years! So, to perform the work for all the dead of the first 6000 years in less than 17 years is absolutely impossible. The number of the dead might as well be infinite, since 100 billion and infinite is equally just as impossible. And ordinances take more than one second to perform, plus there is more than one vicarious ordinance, so the rational mind simply cannot wrap itself around what this man must do “to prepare the way of the Lord.” And yet, he needs something to do, right? Some great task, or a (might as well be infinite) number of great tasks, so that he feels like he’s actually used the enormous endowment of faith and power he’s going to get. So the Lord has to make it challenging for him. At least, that is the sense I’m getting. So, pretty much everything will be thrown onto his shoulders, for him to complete in record time.

  15. There are indeed BCE burial grounds with infant bones. (I found this http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0009177 )
    Why were they not partakers of THE first resurrection (right after Christ was resurrected)?

  16. Perhaps the definition of resurrection should be redefined in our minds. Maybe resurrection is a re-birth into mortality?? Also, maybe Paul was condemning the practice of baptisms for the dead…at least that seems to be the case when taken in context of the whole chapter.

  17. Your assumption about Moroni is wrong . It was Nephi who appeared to Joseph a s shown by Joseph’s own reselling in the Times and Season in 1842. David Whiters entire family consistently referred to the angel that showed the plates to Mary Whitmer and to the 3 Witnesses as ” brother Nephi”. Thus your theory about the entire resurrection seems misconceived

  18. Boo, there seems to be plenty of evidence that that is not true. Even scriptural evidence.

    http://en.fairmormon.org/Moroni%27s_visit/Nephi_or_Moroni

  19. Boo, Moroni’s full name (given plus surname) is: Moroni Nephi.

  20. jackdale76, Sorry it took me so long to answer your question about the infant bones. Truth be told, at the time you asked I didn’t know the answer. But now I know, so here’s the answer. You asked,

    Im curious to know if there are any pre-AD era bones of an infant (who was supposed to have been resurrected in THE first resurrection of A first resurrection)

    There are indeed BCE burial grounds with infant bones. (I found this http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0009177 )
    Why were they not partakers of THE first resurrection (right after Christ was resurrected)?

    So, the answer is that infants must still be written on the earthly priesthood records before they can be resurrected. When we bless our young children, they become “children of record.” This means that we take their names and write them on the earthly priesthood records (the church records.) This allows them to be resurrected.

    This doctrine deals with the Book of Life and its interaction with the earthly priesthood records. The two records must match. Little children don’t need ordinance work prior to resurrection, being alive in Christ, so they have their names already written in the Book of Life. All that they lack, then, is that there is a matching, or corresponding, priesthood record, that also has their names written there. This is the reason why we even have “children of record.” If the little child dies before the age of 8, because its name is written in the earthly priesthood records, there is no delay to its resurrection. It has all that is needed to be resurrected.

    So, all little children that have ever existed and died before the age of 8 must be written into the priesthood records, and if this hasn’t happened, it means that this is yet another task that the Josephite will be required to complete before Christ gets here.

    I do not think I have expounded upon the Book of Life on this blog. (I have in private, though.) Anyway, to be brief, we all start out written in the Book of Life, and then, through transgression, our names are blotted out, but through repentance, etc., they get written back in, along with our works (the ordinances we have received, etc.) So, all little children start out written in that book, but again, the other record, the earthly priesthood record, is the record by which we are judged, and the two records must match, the earthly and the heavenly records exactly matching, so these children must have their names written in the earthly books, too, otherwise they cannot be judged at the last day (for if they were judged they would be condemned, making the judgment unjust.) Those who don’t have their names written in the Book of Life and in the priesthood records at the last day are the ones that go into the lake of fire and brimstone. If your name isn’t found written in the earthly priesthood records, then it won’t be found written in the heavenly Book of Life, and you will be screwed. God doesn’t want that to happen to innocent, saved, little children, therefore their resurrection is delayed (they are not judged) until their names are in the earthly priesthood records, because the same principle applies to them, as to all others, and if they were resurrected without their names in the earthly books, the Book of Life (which originally had their names written in it) would not show their names, and they’d be cast off forever.

    This doctrine shows that all those who say the church is apostate, or is unnecessary for salvation, are ignorant fools. The church books, like all priesthood records, are required for salvation. You don’t get on those books, you don’t get saved. This doctrine is according to the “keys of the kingdom of heaven” given to Peter, whereby what is written in the priesthood records gets recorded in the Book of Life, and what is not written in those records is not recorded in the Book of Life. You can hem and haw all you want about not wanting to submit to the church authorities, but they hold the keys of writing your name in those books, and thus in a very real sense they hold the keys of your salvation.


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