Surely the Lord God will do nothing, until he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.

A mass of confusion

Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets  (Amos 3:7)

Surely the Lord God will do nothing, until he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets  (JST Amos 3:7)

I like the Joseph Smith Translation version best so that is the text that I will use for this post.

The recent Invitation sent out by the Remnant (Denver Snuffer-inspired) groups got me thinking about how polarized the latter-day saints have become in their testimonies.  I’ve read testimonies claiming that the Holy Ghost manifested the truth of Snuffer’s claims, and testimonies claiming that the Holy Ghost manifested the falsehood of his claims; testimonies that the church is true and the leaders are led and inspired of God and testimonies that the Brethren have departed from the way; all of these claim that their testimonies come from the Holy Ghost.

Additionally, I’ve read opinions of the latter-day saints saying that the Holy Ghost can say one thing to one person, such as “this is true,” and the exact opposite to another person, such as “this is NOT true;” and that it all depends upon what the person needs to hear in that particular moment.  Truth or revelation, then, becomes relative to the circumstances of the person, but the Spirit is the same, meaning such contradictory manifestations proceed from the same Spirit.  On the other hand, there are those who are quick to say that such manifestations DO NOT proceed from the same Spirit, but that one of these contradictory revelations come from a false spirit, or from imaginations of the heart, delusions, wishful thinking, etc.

A little bit of personal history

On this blog I have tried to stay as low key as possible about the real me, my actual experiences in real life, etc., so that no one can recognize me.  But I want to take a little time, for once, and tell a few facts, so that people understand my perspective a little better.

I already said on this blog, on the Baptism of Fire post, I think it was, that when I was nine years old, I had a baptism of fire.  That was the second time the Holy Ghost manifested anything to me.  The first time, I missed it, or did not recognize that I was having a manifestation of the Spirit, because the missionaries neglected to tell me anything about the Holy Ghost, and so I had to put the pieces back together later on, like a detective, and reconstruct what actually happened.  Two or three months after I turned nine years old, the missionaries knocked on my family’s door and during their discussion, in which they read the First Vision account of Joseph Smith, I gained a testimony of him by the power of the Holy Ghost.  I won’t give any more details than that, for it will reveal who I am, for all who know this story will immediately recognize the peculiarity of all the circumstances.  So, after this first manifestation, I had a second one, the baptism of fire, which again, I will not go into all those details, for all who know me are very familiar with this story.

The first two manifestations represented revelations, or manifestations of the spirit of revelation.  After the baptism of fire, I joined the church.  My memory of this next manifestation is a bit sketchy, but I believe it was after my baptism, and not before my baptism, but I know for sure that it was after the baptism of fire, that it occurred, but I don’t remember who I was speaking to; anyway, I was speaking to a family member and I prophesied that all of our immediate family would end up joining the church.  This was the third time I had received a manifestation of the Holy Ghost, and it was a manifestation of the spirit of prophecy.

The prophecy itself was significant, in that one of our family was a professed atheist and agnostic, but within about three years became converted to the Lord and joined the church, nonetheless.

After my baptism, we began attending church on a regular basis, and I became churched.  By this I mean that I turned my attention from where it was, on God, to the 15 Brethren and the Church, and I became a more or less normal latter-day saint, like any other Mormon boy, except for the curious experiences I had as an investigator and new member.  Not surprisingly, the manifestations of the Holy Ghost altogether ceased.

Five years went by in spiritual silence, with me not understanding why the manifestations stopped, for I was very confused as to why the Spirit was no longer speaking to me.  This may have been normal for other members, but it was not the normal that I wanted.  I joined the church wanting to experience the same things the ancient saints experienced, all their various manifestations, and I got them, at first, but now they suddenly ceased, and I was very upset about it.  “What was I doing wrong?” I wondered.

However, when I was 14 years old, I went to General Conference and while listening to the current president of the church speaking, the Holy Ghost again fell upon me and declared that the man was a prophet of God and was speaking the truth.  “At last!,” I thought.  “The Spirit speaks to me again!”  And what was the man saying?  He was calling the church to repentance, telling everyone to read the Book of Mormon.

I thought, “Well, it certainly is true that I have been a member of this church for about 5 years now and I have never, not even once, attempted to read the Book of Mormon.  That must be what I am doing wrong.”  So, I made the attempt.

Again, I will leave out a lot of details.  Suffice it to say that I began reading that book, and I prayed fervently every day, for about 15 straight days, to have the Holy Ghost manifest to me that it was true.  On the 14 or 15th day, as I was reading somewhere in Alma, the Holy Ghost again manifested to me, saying that: “What you read is true!” (referring to the entirely of the book.)

This was my fifth manifestation of the Holy Ghost and the fourth manifestation of the spirit of revelation to date.

Now, from this time forward, I completed the book and became quite depressed; for the Book of Mormon called me to repentance, for I had grown prideful and hard-hearted in the last five years, and although I made a conscious effort to put the Book of Mormon teachings into practice, it was very difficult.  The doctrine of that book was different than what I was being taught at church or at home or at school.  No one taught me the things I learned from that book.  The Book of Mormon was, essentially, my only doctrinal teacher; the prophets who wrote it the only ones that taught me the actual doctrine of Christ.  So powerful an effect it had on me that it became my all-time favorite book, and I was an avid reader who liked a lot of books, so that was saying a lot.

To give you an idea of how prideful I was, let’s fast-forward just one year forward, when I was fifteen.  I received my patriarchal blessing and after the blessing went home.  Some time passed and then I got the written copy.  “What’s this?  These written words are not perfectly accurate according to my memory.  They typed it up wrong.”  So, I called up the patriarch.  “You typed it out wrong.”  “No, I assure you, we got it right.  We recorded it with a tape recorder and my wife typed it out as she heard it directly from the speaker.  It is word-for-word.”  “No, you messed it up.  In such-and-such a part, you missed this part that said so-and-so.”  “Well, I can’t account for what you heard, but that was not on the recording.”  And I argued with the man, back and forth, in frustration that they did not record it correctly!  Now, who in the world argues with a patriarch over their blessing?

In hindsight, I now know what happened.  But it took an adult mind who has had many years of experience with the Holy Ghost to figure out what happened during that blessing session, which caused the 15 year old me such consternation and frustration, to the point of sticking to my guns and telling the man the recording was wrong and that my memory of the event was superior to the recording.  Was the recording wrong?  No, it was correct.  Those were the very words that the patriarch spoke.  Was my memory wrong?  No, it was correct.  Those were the very words that the Holy Ghost spoke to me, and added to the blessing, above and beyond what the patriarch said.  There was a sort of double prophecy going on during that session, one upon the patriarch and one upon me.  But I did not know it, and neither did he, hence the confusion and subsequent angry phone call.

I mention this to show how prideful I was, but also to show that from the time of the manifestation of the Book of Mormon to me, at age 14, to now, the Holy Ghost never stopped manifesting revelations and prophecies to me.  And it was because I began, again, to turn my attention back to God, where it was when I was nine years old.  As a result, spiritual “stuff” started pouring through, and has only increased as the years go by, as I get more proficient in these things and more obedient to God.

Now, when I was a teenager, I used to call all these manifestations, “revelations.”  This, because I was still quite churched and assumed that only the 15 Brethren could receive prophecy, but it was perfectly okay for members to receive personal revelations.  (Looking back, it is amazing just how indoctrinated I became in 5 short years of attending church!)  Later on, though, with my now adult mind, I realized that many of these things that I always called, “revelations,” were in actuality prophecies.

Revelations and prophecies were not the only two types of manifestations I received over the years.  The gift of the discerning of spirits, for a long time, was the one gift that I thought I most definitely had.  But also other manifestations of the gifts have happened, which I won’t go into.

I used to think all this stuff was just normal.  Anyone I talked to and told them some of the stuff I was getting (and it was a lot of stuff), would just listen, but wouldn’t say anything.  I thought that it was because they believed my words.  I found out on the mission, as a now adult, that this was not the case.  They just didn’t want to put down a child.  On my mission, though, I discovered that no one believed a single thing I ever said, about any of these manifestations.  Not even my missionary companions.

I came home from my mission quite depressed, that I got all this “stuff” from the Spirit, almost constantly, but no one believe a word of it.  What good was a testimony if no one believed your word?  I thought, at the time, that this was just my mission environment, but upon returning home, I discovered that my friends, now adults like me, were as unbelieving as the unbelievers and missionary companions of my mission.

For example, upon returning home, I received a double prophecy: first this will happen, then that will happen.  The prophecy was sure and not in any way conditional.  I decided to inform the church friends of my youth.  Surely they will believe it.  I told them the first part of the prophecy, but kept the second part secret.

They said, “Well, it is possible that it could happen.”  I affirmed it was a sure prophecy and that it would happen even as it was spoken.  Then conditions changed drastically, making it improbable.  “Well, there is a chance, but it is not likely it will happen.”  I continued to affirm and assert the sureness of the prophecy.  Then conditions changed even more drastically, making it impossible.  “Well, I guess it wasn’t a prophecy, after all.  There is no way it can happen.”  What?  I thought you guys believed me?  I said it was a prophecy, given of God, not a prediction!  It will happen, just as stated!  “You are crazy to believe this will still come to pass.”

Years went by and I ditched these believer friends who were really unbelievers in believers’ clothing.  I had many chances to mention the prophecy to others.  Same reaction: “You are nuts.  This thing is absolutely impossible.  Let’s stop hanging around the crazy man.”  I stopped saying the prophecy.  More years went by.  I waited for the change in conditions.  Suddenly conditions changed drastically.  They continued changing drastically, opening up the fulfillment of the prophecy.  Miracles happened, which paved the way for the fulfillment of the prophecy.  Then…the prophecy was fulfilled, every whit!

The second part of the prophecy is still unfulfilled, but I am as confident as ever that it, too, will be miraculously fulfilled.

When I point to that first part of the double prophecy, to those who know about its impossible fulfillment, they don’t want to talk about it.  “That’s old news.  What about all the many other utterances you have made?”  What about this other prophecy I spoke which was fulfilled every whit?  “We don’t care about that, either.”  What about this other thing that also proved that the manifestations I receive are true?  “Old news.  Show us that these other, impossible prophecies are true, and then we’ll believe you.  Otherwise, we just think you are crazy.”

And so it goes.  I am met with a wall of unbelief at every hand, and those who have heard any of the prophecies I have uttered, cannot accept them as true, therefore they almost always think I must be delusional or something.

Looking back, I realize that all those people who heard me throughout the years, and held their tongues, did so because they must have thought I was nuts.

And now when the king had heard these words, he said unto his priests:

Away with this fellow, and slay him; for what have we to do with him, for he is mad.

And they stood forth and attempted to lay their hands on him; but he withstood them, and said unto them:

Touch me not, for God shall smite you if ye lay your hands upon me, for I have not delivered the message which the Lord sent me to deliver; neither have I told you that which ye requested that I should tell; therefore, God will not suffer that I shall be destroyed at this time.  But I must fulfil the commandments wherewith God has commanded me; and because I have told you the truth ye are angry with me. And again, because I have spoken the word of God ye have judged me that I am mad.  (Mosiah 13:1-4)

Up until the last few years, all my revelations have been personal, meaning for my consumption only.  But a recent change got me taking messages given to me by the Lord to deliver to other people.  Nothing ticks off a person more than you bringing them a word of the Lord against them, testifying of their iniquities, telling them to repent, and issuing a prophecy of what will happen if they do not repent.  I never expected to be doing this, but it has happened, and I got the same treatment as the other guys: both the message and messenger is despised and mistreated, the message is not believed, and the messenger’s situation is made worse as a result.

I read stuff like this now and go: “Oh, yeah, I totally understand what he’s getting at!”

Behold ye are worse than they; for as the Lord liveth, if a prophet come among you and declareth unto you the word of the Lord, which testifieth of your sins and iniquities, ye are angry with him, and cast him out and seek all manner of ways to destroy him; yea, you will say that he is a false prophet, and that he is a sinner, and of the devil, because he testifieth that your deeds are evil.  (Helaman 13:26)

My boyhood desire to experience what the ancients experienced didn’t include their persecutions, but I guess at least I can say I know what it’s like…

Conditions will change

Regardless of what anyone believes about me, none of that matters one bit.  None of my prophecies have failed and none shall.  Those that have been fulfilled have been fulfilled every whit.  Those that haven’t been fulfilled, haven’t yet.  These things take time, and it all comes down to the change in conditions.  My adversaries hate the fact that I am more confident than ever about every single thing I’ve prophesied coming to pass.  They point to that as evidence of insanity, “For surely these many things you’ve said are impossible!”  I point to my hundreds of manifestations and to their one or two manifestations (had when they were young) and say that that is evidence that they are spiritually dead.

Now, I don’t go around saying that I am a prophet, but I dang sure will not deny that I have the spirit of prophecy and revelation, and when it manifests, I ain’t gonna deny that.  This leads me to some perplexities.


In all my years, I’ve only met a handful of people that I felt, or discerned by the discerning of spirits, had the Holy Ghost upon them, manifesting one of the gifts.  A mere handful.  As in no more than five people.  Out of hundreds or thousands of latter-day saints I’ve met over the years.  So, to say you are a latter-day saint doesn’t mean much to me.  If I discern the seed of faith in you and the Holy Ghost, then you start blipping on my radar, and I begin to rejoice.  Otherwise, you are essentially spiritually dormant (sleeping), if not altogether dead.  To me, at least.  This, I suppose, ticks people off, when they see I ain’t impressed.

So, when I look to all those making this or that claim, I wonder what the heck is going on?  If Amos’ words are true, then God won’t do anything until he reveals the secret to His prophets.  But who are His prophets?

Those who are loyal and faithful latter-day saints, look to the 15 Brethren and say they are the Lord’s prophets.  Others look to other people, such as Denver Snuffer or others, and say they, or he, is the Lord’s prophet.  I’ll use Denver as my example.

Denver says the Lord told me this thing, fulfilling the words of Amos, but didn’t say the same to the 15 Brethren, because they ain’t prophets.  Those who follow Denver say, “Amen, brother!”  The 15 say the Lord didn’t say this to us because He never said it at all.  We are His prophets, so if He speaks, He’ll speak to us.  The fact that He hasn’t told us that, means He hasn’t told Denver, either!  Denver is just making it up as he goes along.  This proves he’s not a prophet, ’cause if he was, he’d be saying what we say!  Those who follow the 15 say, “Amen, Brethren!”

Now, I got a real problem with this mess, because I sure as heck know that the Holy Ghost has been manifesting revelations and prophecies to me about a great number of things, but I’ll just pick a recent topic that has my attention of late: the Josephite, and none of these 16 individuals have said even a dang peep about this thing.  In fact, no one, but myself, has said anything about the Josephite.

Now, I’m going to pull a 15-year old LDS Anarchist on them all and stick to my guns and say to them like I said to that old patriarch, that I ain’t the one in error. If y’all ain’t receiving manifestations and revelations and prophecies on this guy, then y’all wack. Which means none of you are prophets.

I have looked at the Denver matter and the Spirit says nothing to me about it. I have looked at others professing this or that claim, and the Spirit says nothing to me about them, either. But when I looked at Joseph Smith, the Spirit immediately manifested. When I look at the 15 Brethren, I know they have the keys of the priesthood, and that is good enough for me. But prophets? Sorry, but the Spirit hasn’t manifested any such thing to me. The five individuals I mentioned do not include General Authorities.

I also look at all these people saying, “God spoke to me and said this” or “God said that to me” and I notice that a lot of these manifestations are always along the same lines. Catastrophe is coming, end times stuff, cleaning of the church, and so forth. There seem to be patterns of “manifestations” and “revelations” among latter-day saints. But, the stuff I get doesn’t fit these patterns. There’s going to be a new set of articles of confederation? Who, besides myself, has prophesied such a thing? The state of Israel is going to be broken up? Again, who has prophesied these things, besides myself? An earthquake is going to break up the church? The Book of Mormon is going to retranslated? And so on and so forth.

I feel like the odd man out. I feel like Jeremiah, surrounded by all these many phony prophets who said that Jerusalem would stand forever and he alone said no, it was going to be destroyed. No one is saying what I am saying. My adversaries would say, “That’s because you are insane. They are right, and you are wrong. They are all saying similar things because they have the Spirit, and are saints, while you are the real sinner and in need of repentance, yet you call us the sinners.” Sha, and monkeys might fly out of my butt.

What I know is this: what I said on this blog, that are prophecies, will come to pass, for they are real prophecies given of the Holy Ghost, and all these people professing prophecy or prophetic mantle, who don’t know anything about what I say, are suspect in my estimation, from top to bottom, your claims and titles be damned, for why hasn’t the Lord revealed these secrets, which are written on this blog, to all you phonies, er, I mean, guys?

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  1. yes i could only believe or it is hard to believe them since most of your subjects as far as i can comprehend are quite far-fetched, considering contemporary conditions. but i think i understand it is the nature of prophecy when viewed on mundane spectacles.

  2. you have no idea how much this article hit home. I’ve been having very similar things, and when I try to talk to friends, member friends who are usually spiritually astute, they respond politely but in a way that is clear that they think I’m a nut. I hate to sound like the ‘me too’ people, but, I literally have these revelations/prophecy, manifestations of the Spirit come and then they happen.
    For a while it troubled me because of the idea that only one man can have revelation outside of personal revelation, I thought surely I must be crazy. But as it happened more and more and I came to understand the differences in revelation, prophecy, priesthood keys and guiding the church.

  3. Could we maybe get a list or link to all the prophecies you’ve made on here?

  4. Could we maybe get a list or link to all the prophecies you’ve made on here?

    These things are scattered all over this blog, sometimes in the posts, sometimes hidden down in the comments below the post. If you find anything I’ve written and want clarification if it’s a prophecy, just quote it to me and ask and I’ll tell you whether it was given to me by the spirit of prophecy or not.

  5. Some post corrections

    After I wrote the post I began pondering over those days, when I was nine years old, and I remembered that I had received four manifestations of the Holy Ghost, not three like I said, before the five year dry spell. So, to be perfectly accurate, here is the corrected list:

    1) A manifestation of the spirit of revelation, had during the first missionary discussion, in which I learned about Joseph Smith’s First Vision, 2) a manifestation of the discerning of spirits, had during the missionary discussions, 3) a manifestation of the spirit of revelation, accompanied by a baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost, had during my first ever attendance of a Mormon church service, 4) a manifestation of the spirit of prophecy, uttered to a member of my family.

    There is no need for me to go into the discerning of spirits event, since that is not the topic of this post.

    Another correction is that I had forgotten that soon after I had the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost, I told the experience to a man, who did not believe it and who took it upon himself to try to get me to deny it and to admit that It was all either my imagination, or I was pretending and just making it all up, and his method of persuasion was to revile, ridicule, mock and belittle me incessantly, making my life a living hell from that moment on. It was like the devil himself decided to take up residence in this man and target me, he becoming evil incarnate. Despite the persecution heaped on me by this grown man, I stood my ground and would not deny it, but continued to testify to its truth. But this experience I had with such a vile and despicable spirit of persecution altered my natural tendency to tell all to everyone, and from that point on I became very careful what I said and who I said it to, making sure to “test the waters,” so to speak, with small bits of revelation or prophecy, to gauge their reaction, before telling anything that I considered truly noteworthy or remarkable. As a result of this strategy, I had quite a happy childhood with my friends, who were all non-member friends, for we lived in an area in which there were no other Mormons in our city or in any of the surrounding cities, and so I did not tell anybody in this area of any my spiritual experiences, thus by-passing the spirit of persecution until I grew up. In hindsight, had I read the Book of Mormon from the get-go, and thus been taught the pure gospel, I probably would have continued to testify, to everyone, and this spirit of persecution would have attended me for all my life.

  6. But as it happened more and more and I came to understand the differences in revelation, prophecy, priesthood keys and guiding the church.

    Everyone thinks that the gifts come with the keys of the priesthood, and with particular offices, but the office and the keys have nothing to do with them. They should go hand-in-hand, but they often don’t. But that doesn’t bother me. I say, “Recognize the office, and the keys, and the gifts (if they are there); but if the gifts are not there, recognize the offices and keys, anyway; and if there are no offices or keys, but there are gifts, recognize them.”

    Our obsession with keys and offices and with the gift titles (prophet, seer, revelator, translator, healer, miracle worker, etc.) has caused a delusion to come upon the latter-day saints, in our desire to have these things be joined.

    And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: that they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thessalonians 2:11-12)

    On the one hand, those with keys and offices come, and they say, “Call and sustain us by the gift titles,” and we do so, even though they don’t manifest these titular gifts. Thus, the ones with the keys and offices delude themselves into believing that they have the gifts, because they have the keys and offices, and those who look to them delude themselves that they are following those with both keys, offices and gifts, because, well, they have called and sustained them by the gift titles and they have the keys. The delusion, then, is that possession of keys = possession of gifts.

    On the other hand, those without keys and offices come, and they profess to manifest the gifts, and in our anxiety over the lack of gifts and in our desire to follow anyone who has the gifts, we call and sustain them by the gift titles. Then, they, being called and sustained by some, then claim to themselves also the keys, as if they “wrested” the same from the first group. And those who sustain them believe it. Thus, those professing the gifts delude themselves into believing that they have the keys, because they profess to manifest the gifts. And their followers delude themselves into believing that they are following those with both keys and gifts, because of this claim to have manifested gifts, and also the belief of a “wresting” of keys. The delusion, then, in this case, is that the claim of the possession of gifts = the possession of both keys and gifts.

    On the third hand (imagine, uh, Stitch, who has four hands, two of which are retractable), those who actually do manifest the gifts, but who don’t have any keys that are recognized by the people, come, and these are cast out by the people as chaff. Thus the people delude themselves that the actual manifestation of gifts without the possession of recognizable keys = no possession of gifts.

    “The world always mistook false prophets for true ones, and those that were sent of God, they considered to be false prophets, and hence they killed, stoned, punished and imprisoned the true prophets, and these had to hide themselves ‘in deserts and dens, and caves of the earth,’ and though the most honorable men of the earth, they banished them from their society as vagabonds, whilst they cherished, honored and supported knaves, vagabonds, hypocrites, impostors, and the basest of men” (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, 206).

    There are to be false prophets, false apostles, condemned bishops, etc., in these latter days:

    For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. (2 Corinthians 11:13-15)

    Behold, I, the Lord, have made my church in these last days like unto a judge sitting on a hill, or in a high place, to judge the nations. For it shall come to pass that the inhabitants of Zion shall judge all things pertaining to Zion. And liars and hypocrites shall be proved by them, and they who are not apostles and prophets shall be known. And even the bishop, who is a judge, and his counselors, if they are not faithful in their stewardships shall be condemned, and others shall be planted in their stead. (D&C 64:37-40)

    I am not going to expound this stuff, except to say that there are a lot of false spirits at play, and I must suppose that there will be many more false spirits playing around in the future, to more fully deceive the masses.

    My purpose in giving some personal experience in the post was to show that I am making my assessment based on my personal experience and not on any theory I have. I have had actual and continuing experiences since age nine with the things of God, and also with the things of the devil, on a yearly basis, (with a five year dry period,) and thus, based on this growing body of experience, I am qualified to make an assessment and call BS in spiritual experiences when I see it. I have had two devils visibly appear to me once and attempt to end my life–and through God’s intervention, I survived that one; on another occasion I had a bunch of unseen evil spirits audibly try to get me to doubt and deny my testimony, (which didn’t work, since I just rebuked them in the name of Jesus; ) so I know there are plenty of false spirits out there. So, people simply making a claim to having experienced the things of God isn’t enough to persuade me.

    The measuring stick, then, that I use, is the scriptures, first, and my revelations and prophecies and other manifestations, second. If your experience doesn’t match the doctrine in the scriptures, sorry, but I call BS. If it passes the scriptures, but contradicts my revelations or prophecies, sorry, but I call BS. Now, this drives people who know me up the dang wall, because they know that my revelations always trump theirs. There is nothing ever “iffy” about what I receive. If I say the Spirit said, “Such-and-such,” to me, you can bet your life on it. I put it forth as the absolute word of God, even the latest word. And after receiving the revelation, I’ll open the scriptures and prove, from the scriptures, that the new doctrine I received from the Spirit and put forth is absolutely true and conforming to the revealed word of God in the scriptural canon. There is never any doubt on my part. Doubt is not one of my weaknesses. My detractors, though, don’t do this. Everything about them is “iffy” and filled with doubt. They doubt the slightest thing received from God. If the Spirit says anything to them, at all, they wonder whether this was the voice of the Spirit or just their imagination. Their uncertainty of all things spiritual is contrasted by my absolute certainty of all things spiritual. This is why no one likes to have a theological discussion with me, (except those that believe my revelations.) I come off as one who has the heavens open, all the time, to these people. “How do you know?” is the question on everyone’s lips. “How do you know these things?” The Spirit manifested it to me. “How do you know it was the Spirit?” They don’t recognize the voice of the Spirit, but I am more familiar with the Spirit’s voice than with the voice of my own children, or even with my own voice. They think the voice in my head must always, all the time, be mine. They can’t conceive of me being able to differentiate between the Spirit’s voice, speaking to my mind, and my voice, as I think. “Are the voices different?” As different as black and white. One voice puts my body at attention, for it is the voice of God, and my body immediately shakes and responds. The other voice is just me. I am qualified to differentiate, but they don’t believe it.

    The average member of the church goes through spiritual masturbation sessions, in which they find themselves in a church setting, and have an intellectual experience, in which they learn something new, or an emotional experience, in which they feel some powerful and strong emotion, and because they are in a church setting, they assign that as the Spirit manifesting. “The Spirit was really strong in the meeting!” Oh, really? And what did the Spirit say? What did you learn from the Spirit? “The Spirit didn’t say anything, at all, and I didn’t learn anything new that I didn’t already know, but my testimony was strengthened.” A testimony doesn’t get strengthened. That is theoretically impossible. A testimony is something that you know to be true, manifested by the Spirit. You either know something, or don’t know something. It is either true, or not true. Testimonies cannot be strengthened, or be made more true. You cannot have knowledge of truth made “more true.” If someone says, “My testimony was strengthened,” it means they went through a spiritual masturbation session and the Spirit did not manifest to them. It means they are either spiritually dormant or dead. I call BS, and then these people want to pick up something and stone me.

    I don’t have to be in a “church setting” to receive manifestations of the Spirit, for my mind is glued to God at all times. I can be in the most secular setting of all and say, “The Spirit just manifested to me something.” BS, they will say. Why? Because I ain’t in a church setting. To them, it is impossible to receive revelations of God outside of a church setting. Church = God, to these people. And this is why God doesn’t speak to them, and must use those He does speak to, to deliver messages to them.

    So, pulling this all back into the topic of the post, when I see these impostors come forth, I make an assessment, an immediate assessment, and depending on that assessment, I may say something, or keep my mouth shut. In the case of Snuffer and the Remnant groups, I didn’t think much would come of it, and I still don’t, and didn’t think it was worth my time to say anything. Nor about the others out there. After all, I wrote the parable of the wheat and tares post and also the post on evil speaking of the Lord’s anointed, in which I tried, apparently in vain, to teach the principles by which people need not be deceived by these attempts by impostors to lead the Lord’s people astray. And that was sufficient for me. But then the Remnant group went and announced their plans to publish their Invitation in newspapers around the country, which would draw attention to the church, publicly, in a bad way, creating a schism, not in the minds of the members, but in the minds of the non-members, for surely those who read this Invitation would come away with the idea that the LDS church was having a schism. Now, whether they have the money to do this or not doesn’t matter, the fact that they are even making the attempt, all with “good intentions,” is bad enough and they are still left without excuse.

    Anyway, this Invitation, if published, creates a change in conditions, which, upon my learning of it, moved me, prophetically, to change my previous position, from saying nothing, to now speaking my mind, for these things must be denounced, for they conflict and contradict the wheat and tares parable, and thus have no scriptural standing and are inspired of the evil one. So, I must call out the false prophets and false spiritual manifestations, even though nobody will believe me, or ever does. But doing so brings the 15 Brethren into the spotlight, too, for there are many things which are said by the impostors, which are partially or fully true, but then twisted by the impostors and their followers into a false teaching. It all seems like a lot of work to correct all this stuff. And I don’t feel up to it, especially since nobody, or hardly anyone reads these writings. But I think I know of a way to, at least, get the attention of those whose attention needs to be gotten. I will write a new post to give a key whereby people can stop being so deceived by these impostors.

  7. Grateful for your words as always. Couple of quick questions. Have you had your crossroads yet? How many abrahamic tests have you faced? Have you seen and understood: Back to the future, OZ the great and powerful, world war Z, contagion, the matrix, and the Lego movie? Do you know the marks the Josephite will bare and where they will be? Have you seen the sign of his coming on the mountains to the east? Do these numbers mean anything to you? 76, 108, 128, 133, 139, 144, 801, 802?

  8. Have you had your crossroads yet?

    I’m not even sure what that means.

    How many abrahamic tests have you faced?

    I’ve never been told to sacrifice my son, so I guess none.

    Have you seen and understood: Back to the future, OZ the great and powerful, world war Z, contagion, the matrix, and the Lego movie?

    I saw Back to the Future, The Wizard of OZ (but not Oz the Great and Powerful), The Matrix and the Lego Movie, and, as far as I know, I understood all of them, but I haven’t seen World War Z (tried to watch it, but got bored) or Contagion (no interest).

    Do you know the marks the Josephite will bare and where they will be?

    I was not aware that the Josephite would be wearing marks, but it wouldn’t surprise me if he was. The Spirit hasn’t revealed any such thing to me.

    Have you seen the sign of his coming on the mountains to the east?

    Again, I was not aware of any sign of the coming of the Josephite on the mountains to the east. If you have a picture of this sign, please post or link to it.

    Do these numbers mean anything to you? 76, 108, 128, 133, 139, 144, 801, 802?

    Nope. Are they lottery numbers?

    Did I fail the questionnaire?

  9. Lds anarchist,

    I currently have the same feelings towards Denver Snuffer that you described (aka nothing). I’ve sincerely studied a good amount of his teachings, but something is off. I don’t think he’s experienced all the things he’s claimed, if he’s experienced any of them. Just like with you, the spirit has born witness to me that the BOM is true and that Joseph Smith was a prophet in a clear undeniable way time and time again.

    It sounds like you are very close to the spirit. I only recently awoke to the knowledge of the church’s apostasy, do you have any advice for someone like me on how to become close to the spirit and thus avoid deception?

    On a side note do you think that the spiritual manifestations that Denver’s followers claim to exhibit are genuine or a deception? If they are a deception, in your experience how can one tell the difference between false gifts of the spirit and true ones?

  10. do you have any advice for someone like me on how to become close to the spirit and thus avoid deception?

    I’ve always just relied upon my spiritual gifts to navigate around deception. So, besides repenting and keeping the commandments of God, always remembering Jesus Christ, and always praying, I’d say seek and rely upon the best gifts:

    And again I say unto you, concerning your confirmation meetings, that if there be any that are not of the church, that are earnestly seeking after the kingdom, ye shall not cast them out. But ye are commanded in all things to ask of God, who giveth liberally; and that which the Spirit testifies unto you even so I would that ye should do in all holiness of heart, walking uprightly before me, considering the end of your salvation, doing all things with prayer and thanksgiving, that ye may not be seduced by evil spirits, or doctrines of devils, or the commandments of men; for some are of men, and others of devils. Wherefore, beware lest ye are deceived; and that ye may not be deceived seek ye earnestly the best gifts, always remembering for what they are given; for verily I say unto you, they are given for the benefit of those who love me and keep all my commandments, and him that seeketh so to do; that all may be benefited that seek or that ask of me, that ask and not for a sign that they may consume it upon their lusts. (D&C 46:6-9)

    On a side note do you think that the spiritual manifestations that Denver’s followers claim to exhibit are genuine or a deception? If they are a deception, in your experience how can one tell the difference between false gifts of the spirit and true ones?

    I believe they genuinely believe they are real. Then later, for some of them, they go, “Oh, I think I was deceived.” And then they back out from following him (or whoever they happen to be following). Then they get confused as to what is real and what is a deception.

    I’m not sure I’m the right guy to ask about this. I got the gift of the discerning of spirits at age nine and since then I’ve been able to tell, immediately, without any hesitation or doubt, what is a manifestation of the Holy Ghost, and what isn’t. Later, at age 20, in my 6th area of my mission, I got the gift of the discerning of gifts:

    And unto the bishop of the church, and unto such as God shall appoint and ordain to watch over the church and to be elders unto the church, are to have it given unto them to discern all those gifts lest there shall be any among you professing and yet be not of God. (D&C 46:27)

    so, I can discern between gifts, but I don’t know how anybody else can, unless they have this discerning of gifts gift, or the professed gift in question (plus the gift of knowing the differences of administration).

    The second gift I received was the gift of revelation (at age nine), but as I had not been taught about the Holy Ghost, I didn’t recognize it as a manifestation of the Holy Ghost. (But I believed the manifestation–using my first gift, the gift of belief or faith–which pleased the Lord anyway.) The Lord corrected this deficiency in me by giving me the gift of the discerning of spirits (at the very next missionary discussion, I think it was), so that now I would be able to recognize the Spirit whenever the Holy Ghost spoke. My point is that without the gifts I have I would be completely clueless about all this stuff, so you need to seek out the gifts and rely upon them and develop them, and not rely upon “guessing.” I think people are just taking any good feeling they have and saying, “Well, I felt good during this thought or experience, so that must be the Spirit manifesting.” There are a lot of things that feel good, which are not the Spirit manifesting.

    Note: I edited a typo.

  11. Having the discerning if spirits and the discerning of gifts would definitely help me out. I’ll have to do some serious study in the scriptures about it and try to figure out how to know for sure when the Holy Ghost is speaking or when it’s something (or someone) else.

    The Denver Snuffer thing has got me all confused. He makes all these incrediable claims to have seens many angels, Christ, the Father, even Joseph and Emma and to be the Lord’s messenger, but doesn’t really act like a prophet (he doesn’t refer to himself as prophet, but based on his claims he would have to be). He doesn’t speak with power and authority from God. He doesn’t put forth any new revelations or prophecies, besides rebaptism, fellowships, and 7 women sustaining a man in the priesthood, all of which don’t square with the scriptures ( I suppose rebaptism does in a way, but not the way the secret way he advocates it.)

    On the flip side he does teach a lot of truth and expounds from the scriptures. His followers all profess to have had a spiritual witness of the Holy Ghost that he is what he professes to be. They all seem to know the scriptures really well too.

    It’s hard to know what to believe. Try as I might I haven’t received the witness that he’s a true prophet so I guess he has to be a false one (I don’t see any other alternative.)

  12. “I believe they genuinely believe they are real. Then later, for some of them, they go, “Oh, I think I was deceived.” And then they back out from following him (or whoever they happen to be following). Then they get confused as to what is real and what is a deception.”

    Yes, that was me. Recovering has been very difficult.

    You say that you received revelation that a particular prophet in the church was actually a prophet (I’m assuming it is Pres. Benson). So, you haven’t received revelation about any presidents from them on? Only that they have the keys?

    So, if the 15 have the keys, then it must be that the Josephite would have to become one of the 15 to obtain the keys? Is my logic correct? Or would he only need to possess the right to have them (e.g.-by birthright)?

  13. Bryan, I only received revelation that President Kimball and President Benson were prophets. I received a manifestation that President Hunter was a bona fide apostle of God (and I think I received that manifestation when he was the president of the church.) For Presidents Hinckley and Monson I have received no manifestations, whatsoever. But yes, I do know that these men (the 15) have the keys, and that is sufficient for me.

    My understanding is that they would have to give him their keys. I don’t think he needs to be part of their quorums. He, of course, will possess at least one key they don’t have (the key to translation), which is necessary for his mission, and I must assume that it will be Elijah the prophet who will return and bestow this priesthood (key) upon him. Unless he has that key, the whole planet and everything on it will be turned into dust (utterly wasted) at the Savior’s fiery return, not just the wicked. (Everything has to be translated, including the earth, before Jesus returns and it will be the Josephite using this key that will do that.) But he also needs the other keys, which the 12 have. He might even need the key to the resurrection, to resurrect the people who lived in the first 4000 years, etc. He is going to need everything to restore everything, to get everything done in the little time he has to do it all. So, I must suppose that he’ll go to the 15 brethren and perform whatever sign God gives him to perform for them, and then they will need to ordain him and give him all the keys they have. He, of course, will be able to use these keys will full power, unlike themselves. They hold the keys, but they do not necessarily wield them in all the ways they can be wielded. They wield them according to what is expedient now, but in that day, he will likely use them in ways they had no idea were even possible, blowing their minds, as well as the minds of everyone else.

    His “birthright” doesn’t grant keys, it only grants a right to have the keys. We’ve got, what?, a little more than 8 weeks left before President-elect Trump takes office, so if this is going to happen now, we don’t have much longer to wait. If he gets empowered at this time, I expect it’ll be before Trump takes office on January 20th.

  14. So, if the earthquake happens that breaks up the church (and the 15 do not live), then what? The Josephite takes their place? Or even if some live, the Josephite still replaces them? At the same time, if some still live, then the church will still be valid. I guess I’m confused with how the priesthood and the ordinances will opperate. Thank you.

  15. Never mind. I found clarification from your post, “The Second Seer”.

  16. Bryan,

    So, if the earthquake happens that breaks up the church (and the 15 do not live), then what? The Josephite takes their place? Or even if some live, the Josephite still replaces them?

    The keys won’t be lost by that earthquake. All the church keys will have been passed on to the Josephite by then and he will be able to re-organize it again, however it will be at that time, (given there will also be a tribal element in play.) The keys will never be entirely lost again. They will be lost to the Gentiles and given to the Israelites, at some time, and the believing Gentiles will incorporate into Israel, but as far as a complete loss of keys from the earth, it will never happen. The keys we currently have on earth are here to stay for all time. The apostates and those crying apostasy are dead wrong on this point. And more keys are coming.

  17. Bryan,

    Never mind.

    Too late. I already answered. 🙂

  18. LDS Anarchist,

    I was always told by my Father, that when reading and pondering the words of men, the “Truth” is always somewhere “In between”.

    So that basically leaves two categories that are not the words of men. The first being the category of insane words that exist outside of the parameters of the words of men that conflict with each other & can never reconcile with truth, and the other category would come from within the conflicts of men that would combine to reveal the truth of God.

    The truth of God would need to come across as very powerful and distinct from the words and opinions of men, and have the power to reconcile the conflicts of men and form those into God’s Truth.

    A premier example of this are the Lords words contained in Malachi concerning the Coming of the Elijah, ( Your Josephite ), to reconcile these differences and place them in there proper perspective….Just as the Jews feel this Elijah will do, when the time comes for him to take his place at the Seder Meal Table and resolve the conflicts of men.

    Your words are either insanely out of sync with reality, or they are precisely insync with Reality. My vote is that your words are INSYNC with the Spirit & Reality as it will eventually be revealed.

    I have a friend who has had similar profound experiences with personal prophecy that always comes to pass.

    You speak things from the scriptures that make Perfect Sense, yet when you make your observations in the comments you write, so few seem to even see them and go on to make comments of their own. A few resonate with your comments but the vast majority seem to pretend not to see them.

    I personally have never heard a More Clear Voice of the Spirit than your own….Sort of like one “Crying out in the wilderness” of unbelief, even among God’s People.

    I suppose only God’s “Elect” can hear that same voice that speaks to you. God’s Elect are only a small portion of God’s People.

    What I take all this to mean, is that the Joesephite and the 144,000 Elect of God, will need to perform the Elijah Mission, headed by the Joesephite, to help those less inclined to hear ALL the truth, come to a knowledge of it and Grow from there. Else wise, Zion would only wind up consisting of the Joesephite and the 144,000. Thus the ignoring of your words until He arrives.

    I think we just need to be patient and wait upon God to release the Josephite & the 144,000 from their “Boxes”, in order to then come to see the Grand Result of that convincing many of the Complete Truth….The Truth that exists somewhere between the conflicting opinions & understanding of men, who are of lesser Spiritual Caliber than God’s Elect, who will be chosen to Lead the Way to Christ & Zion.

    In this vane, I do believe the Spirit can speak two different things to two different people, and for NOW, be the truth as it is understood BEFORE the Joesephite & Elect arrive.

    I think it is just going to take some special kind of “Talking” from the Jospehite and the 144,000 to wake these people up. That time has obviously not yet arrived but I suspect, soon will.

    You sure seem to me to be speaking the “Kind” of Doctrines that are INSYNC with God’s Plan, but it will require the VOICE & POWER of the Joesephite to make those Doctrines come ALIVE for everyone on earth, whether that means to Embrace them and follow this man to Zion, or to totally Reject them and be damned to Hell.

    I’ll tell you what I think of your Words and the Power by which they are spoken. They are similar to those of Avraham Gileadi, who presents merely what Isaiah has already Prophesied of concerning our day, & he definately does this by the True Spirit of God, but is focused more on the analytical approach. His are the REPEATED words of Isaiah made to Come Alive again in our day, as they surely would, as we come close to the time the Joesephite is revealed.

    Gileadi’s words have been with us for quite some time now, & to me reflect the Opening of the bottle that slowly allows the Jeanie to rise up from his reclined position upon his couch and ponder his release.

    Your words are Very Personal and on point with Gileadi’s interpretation of Isaiah, but further add much more precise additional things taken from other parts of the scriptures to suggest the Joesephite is now ready to Burst Forth from that bottle, (Box). Your Words are More Powerful & Precise than Gileadi’s, but do not contradict his analysis.

    I think you are the “One Man” chosen by God to further ADD and bring to a conclusion, what Gileadi began. The two of you are like Bookends that testify for God, what is about to Begin.

    I’m with you 100% in excitement and anticipation for the coming of the Joesephite and the 144,000. I certainly see you as a Prophet chosen by the Lord, according to what I just described of Gileadi and Yourself. Yourself being the Greater of the two. Your Words have certainly Opened My Eyes to my limited understanding of these things.

    I am Very Moved by Your Story and buy it 100%. God Bless You.

  19. To clarify a little more on what I said by comparing you to Avraham Gileadi and that the two of you are like two bookends of God’s Word as contained in Isaiah & other scriptures….Gileadi exemplifies “Revelation” given to him by the Lord, to open our eyes to the Book of Isaiah, which is a Vision of Our Time.

    You, on the other hand, would represent a Greater “Prophecy” of God that expounds & ADDS upon the Vision of Isaiah and Gileadi’s interpretation of them. Your Words are MORE DIRECT, CLEAR & PRECISE, and are Prophecy, as compared to Revelation & Inspiration. They are all the same, but the latter is the Greater of them.

    Gileadi’s Revelation & Inspiration is the Audio voice of God. But your Prophecy is both the Audio & Visual interpretation of the Words of Isaiah & other Prophets you have cited. The next thing to arrive on the scene, must be the Real Thing !

    You truly seem to me, to be the Final Messenger of God’s Messenger to come. You are the only one who understands these things, even more clearly than Avraham Gileadi.

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